The innovation lab is becoming a hallmark feature of any bank or other financial institution.

But once in the lab, what determines whether a startup will make it past the proof-of-concept stage?

“It’s all about those relationships and that trust,” Jason Mars, CEO of conversational AI company Clinc, told Bank Innovation.

Clinc currently has 34 banking relationships at present, and is set to go into production with two more this year — both are “top” banks, according to Mars, though he could not share specifics. Mars has worked with a variety of innovation labs, including one that consists of just two people, and said internal politics is the greatest hurdle to making sure an innovation project actually gets off the ground.

Fostering that sense of trust is a key component of any banking relationship these days, especially as fintechs and banks have definitively eased into a more collaborative environment. The rallying cry of “replace the banks,” seems to be fading into the past.

“We work with banks to provide our checking accounts, we partner very closely to combine our strength and experience,” said Tim Hong, chief marketing officer for MoneyLion. While MoneyLion, a PFM with 2 million customers, did not build its technology in an innovation lab, Hong still cited the human relationship between a bank and a fintech as an essential part of making that partnership a success.

In an innovation lab, “almost a competition” between the innovation lab and the business side of the bank can lead to struggles for the startup, especially as directives set to participants in these labs are often left deliberately vague, Mars said. Something like, “We want to use AI to help make banking better” is a common example, according to Mars.

There are examples of innovation labs where this is less of an issue, like at USAA, for instance.

“Zachary Gipson was the first one who discovered us, at that first Finovate,” Mars said of USAA, adding that the company’s working relationship with the bank led to a POC and pilot in short order, including the deployment of an Alexa skill, that relies on the Clinc’s conversational AI technology.

USAA Bank was not able to comment at press time for this story. Gipson, the bank’s chief innovation officer, has served in that role for just over three years.